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CRAN task view proposal: ClinicalTrials #59
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Ya @ywang-gilead et al., thank you for the initiative and, as previously discussed via e-mail, I think that a relaunch of the task view would be good to make it more active and dynamic again. Also, I think it's great to build on existing initiatives under the umbrella of the ASA and R Consortium. However, some more work is needed before we can move forward:
You don't have to respond to my comments right away but we can also wait for some more comments from my fellow CRAN Task View Editors @rsbivand @eddelbuettel @tuxette Also I'm tagging here the maintainers of the other task views mentioned in case they want to add to the discussion: @ugroempi @tylermorganwall @aallignol @deweyme @wviechtb @billdenney |
I don't know the specific quality metrics being considered. As it relates to the Pharmacokinetics view, I would assume that the Clinical Trials view would reference the Pharmacokinetics view. And, I would assume that there would be little overlap between packages. |
Dear All
Most of the packages in the MetaAnalysis CTV could, in principle, be
used for meta-analysis of clinical trials but none of them is restricted
to such designs. So I would suggest a cross-reference from each to the
other would suffice.
As far as quality is concerned I have not included a couple of packages
in the past. One did not really do what it said on the tin and at least
one more I completely failed to understand what it was claiming to do
even after reading the entire manual. Apart from that they all go in and
I leave it up to the user to check against their own criteria.
Michael
…On 26/10/2023 02:51, Achim Zeileis wrote:
Ya @ywang-gilead <https://github.com/ywang-gilead> et al., thank you for
the initiative and, as previously discussed via e-mail, I think that a
relaunch of the task view would be good to make it more active and
dynamic again. Also, I think it's great to build on existing initiatives
under the umbrella of the ASA and R Consortium. However, some more work
is needed before we can move forward:
* The package inclusions/exclusion guidelines are a too vague. You say
that you want "more hierarchies" but it is unclear to me what is the
intended structure of the task view. And how will this help to
determine whether a package should be included in the task view or not.
* Similarly, more concrete discussion of how to handle the overlap
with other task views is needed. For example, the
|ExperimentalDesign| task view has an explicit list of packages for
design of clinical trials and they suggest that this should be moved
to the |ClinicalTrials| task view. Do you concur with this list or
would you resolve this differently? Explain your strategy. My
impression is that the issues are similar for |Pharmacokinetics|
where there could be more overlap while |Survival| and
|MetaAnalysis| are separated a bit more clearly.
* You indicate that you want to move in the direction of labeling the
quality of R packages, both within this task view and even across
task views. Note that this is not within the scope CRAN Task Views.
As the Documentation
<https://github.com/cran-task-views/ctv/blob/main/Documentation.md>
says: /"The views are intended to have a sharp focus so that it is
sufficiently clear which packages should be included (or excluded) -
and they are not meant to endorse the "best" packages for a given
task"./ The Proposal guidelines
<https://github.com/cran-task-views/ctv/blob/main/Proposal.md>
explain this in a bit more detail:
Ratings: Task views should not rate the packages or endorse
certain "best" packages but rather give an overview of what is
available. A bit of emphasis to the more important packages can
be given in two ways: (1) The most important packages can be
flagged as "core" packages. (2) In the information text the more
important packages can be listed first in the respective sections.
* Regarding the maintainers: First, there has to be a single principal
maintainer who is the principal contact for the task view. Thus,
it's not possible to have two principal maintainers. Second, having
several people from the openstatsware working group is fine because
this is already a rather diverse intiative across companies. But
rather than having all five contributors from the openstatsware
group, I think it would be good to have some outside co-maintainers
as well, ideally also including someone from academia.
You don't have to respond to my comments right away but we can also wait
for some more comments from my fellow CRAN Task View Editors @rsbivand
<https://github.com/rsbivand> @eddelbuettel
<https://github.com/eddelbuettel> @tuxette <https://github.com/tuxette>
Also I'm tagging here the maintainers of the other task views mentioned
in case they want to add to the discussion: @ugroempi
<https://github.com/ugroempi> @tylermorganwall
<https://github.com/tylermorganwall> @aallignol
<https://github.com/aallignol> @deweyme <https://github.com/deweyme>
@wviechtb <https://github.com/wviechtb> @billdenney
<https://github.com/billdenney>
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|
Thank you for the proposal. I have not much to add to @zeileis 's comments. There might be a minor overlap with Epidemiology as well. |
Thanks a lot for the comments. We have incorporated them into our revised proposal as follows. ScopeThis task view aims to collect information on R packages for clinical trial design, monitoring, analysis and reporting. Packages
Overlap
Maintainers
|
I have no general objections to the proposal. As co-maintainer of the Meta-analysis task view, I will just reiterate what @deweyme already touched on. It isn't really clear to me how one would define an R package for meta-analysis that is "designed for clinical trials". The same applies to the potential overlap with other task views (like ExperimentalDesign and Survival and 'Longitudinal data analysis' also overlaps with the MixedModels task view), that is, how does one determine whether a package from these other task views is designed for clinical trials? |
@ywang-gilead : Thank you for your answer and the clarification / corrections. I think that they cover most of @zeileis 's comments. Additional remarks:
I let @zeileis @rsbivand @eddelbuettel react as well but I think that the proposal is interesting and that you can go on working on it. |
Hi @ywang-gilead, We were directed here through our proposal for a new task view for the pharmaverse collection of packages, which we've submitted here. Per @zeileis, the suggestion is that may be logical to fold our collection of packages into the updates relevant to this proposal. We've drafted the task view, which you can additionally review here and see why we've suggested a specific scope of packages. Could you please share your thoughts on if/how you see value in combining these packages within the ClinicalTrials task view? |
Hi @mstackhouse , Thanks a lot for the additional information. I'm thinking of scheduling a meeting for us (CTV ClinicalTrials maintainers and pharmaverse maintainers) to discuss the possibility to combine these two task views and how we could collaborate. I will send out an email to everyone and hopefully we can find some time next week that works for all of us. Does that sound good to you? |
Just wanted to leave a note here that both groups of maintainers met as a team. We mutually decided that right now it's better to keep our proposed task views separate and reassess in the future if it makes sense to combine them. We will continue to address feedback in #60 |
Hi, I am not sure that the current Task View concept as a narrative list of packages for a specific scope is the best solution to inform users of relevant packages and whether this will scale with the increasing number of packages. I would suggest to allow package developers to add a field in the description file which says in which task views their package should be listed. The Task view could then be compiled automatically, eg the package name and description (oneliner) could be automagically extracted from the Description file. The Task view page/table could also show additional quality attributes for each package to guide users (first release, last release, number of users, user rating, author credibility, ...). |
Dear Wilmar
In the MetaAnalysis CTV we try to provide some structure to the list of
packages. It is hard to see how the software you propose would know
which section(s) the new package might appear in. Several of the
packages appear in more than one section. If we abandon the idea of
curating and organising the list it will become much harder for people
to find the relevant package which might fit their needs.
Michael
…On 12/03/2024 15:35, Wilmar Igl wrote:
Hi, I am not sure that the current Task View concept as a narrative list
of packages for a specific scope is the best solution to inform users of
relevant packages and whether this will scale with the increasing number
of packages. I would suggest to allow package developers to add a field
in the description file which says in which task views their package
should be listed. The Task view could then be compiled automatically, eg
the package name and description (oneliner) could be automagically
extracted from the Description file. The Task view page/table could also
show additional quality attributes for each package to guide users
(first release, last release, number of users, user rating, author
credibility, ...).
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Michael
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Wilmar, thanks for your feedback. There are indeed different potential solutions for generating topic-related lists of packages - with differents strengths and different drawbacks. As Michael already explained, CRAN Task Views aim to be curated lists with a sharp focus. When package maintainers can self-select their package into the task views, this sharp focus would likely be lost. Both because some less relevant packages would be included - but also because some very relevant packages would not be. To learn more about the ideas and strategies behind the CRAN Task View Initiative, you can have a look at this paper: doi10.48550/arXiv.2305.17573: |
Hi @ywang-gilead and col. We were very close to a final version for this proposal: do you want to implement the last suggested changes (see comments since your last proposal) so that we can proceed to the publication? |
Hi @tuxette, we will implement the last suggested changes and provide a draft task view for review. |
Hi @ya-wang-git et al., we essentially did not have any updates over the entire year and there still isn't a proper draft. Maybe you want to include the work on the task view in your new year's resolution for 2025? Or when there is no interest or no time anymore, we should close this issue. |
Thanks for the draft @ya-wang-git, good to know that this is still alive. From a quick glance, the draft looks promising, thank you and the co-maintainers for your work on this. It is very much appreciated. Regarding the "submission for feedback before Christmas": I think that everyone is about to start into their well-deserved holidays and hence I don't expect any feedback before everyone is returning to work next year... |
Thanks a lot @zeileis. Just to clarify, the Christmas deadline is for us to finalize and send it out, not for you to complete the review and provide feedback. Please feel free to take your time with the review. Wishing you a joyful holiday season! |
I understand. However, I'm not fond of putting things on other people's to-do lists right before the holidays. In my opinion it's unnecessarily stressful for everyone involved... |
Thanks a lot for sharing your perspective. I completely understand, and I'll be more mindful of this moving forward. |
Thanks for your proposal. I reviewed it and provide a few recommendations below:
|
As far as the meta-analysis section is concerned the following occur to me
|
Prior to this proposal we have reached out to the CRAN task view editors regarding a possible update of the existing ClinicalTrial task view. They advised using this issue to propose a relaunch that can then be discussed.
Scope
This task view aims to collect information on R packages for clinical trial design, monitoring, analysis and reporting.
Packages
Overlap
Maintainers
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